'09 RAM 1500 - 87 Tune Knock

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:40 pm

I have a 2009 Dodge RAM 1500 5.7L HEMI, and after installing the 87 tune I was noticing a lot of knock at WOT, cruising speeds, and when MDS kicked in. I'm running 89 octane. Can this easily be fixed?

I'm under the impression ST Knock should be 0 and can vary to about 1-2 when gear shifts occur but drop back to 0 quickly, and LT Knock should always be 0.

I was getting a ST Knock that went as high as 16 and was steady around 4-6 and my LT Knock was around 2-3. I returned the truck back to stock as of recently.

Post by **mikel** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:55 pm

HOLY COW!

Thats a LOT of knock.... 16, really?

Makes me think there is another issue maybe?
Have you logged the stock tune to see if it is knocking too? (I would imagine it HAS to be).

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Tue Nov 17, 2009 12:13 am

I never saw the 16 it was the highest value on the ST Knock range on the Digital Gauge. Here are 2 logs. Home2 is with the 87 tune and Cruise1_Nov16 is back to stock that I took today. This is just driving around, I haven't had time or found a spot to get a WOT log due to traffic and living in the middle of Houston.

Oh I forgot to mention I have an Airaid MXP Intake and 18" Mufflex Muffler if that makes much of a difference.

I'm new to this so maybe you can help me understand what I need to do or what I'm looking at.

M15 · Post by **M15** » Sun Nov 29, 2009 9:38 pm

I get knock on the 87 tune also.Mainly on part throttle. Kind of wonder if it has anything to do with our VVT. So right now Im just running the modify stock tune with 3 degrees advanced on 91 gas until i get a different tune or if theres an update.

mdittrich · Post by **mdittrich** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 11:23 am

I have been playing around with my 87 tune and wanted some clarification on this. When Oosik said he was at 16 does this mean the truck is automatically pulling timing. If that is the case aren't we losing performance when this happens and our goal to have the best performance to run as close to 0 as possible. I have been trying to get back to 0 (originally at 7.5) and currently running 3.5 at 3800 rpm as a high. Problem is as I have added fuel it appears to run smoother but with slower 0-60 times. Look forward to seeing a reply from Diablo on this one. A lot of guys on the dodge forums have the same question.

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 2:20 pm

mdittrich do you have any mods or have MDS turned on/off?

I might try messing with the spark advance and see how it goes. Still baffled to why the 87 tune has the knock sensors going crazy but once I switch back to the stock no problems, even when MDS engages. Any insight would be helpful and greatly appreciated. I feel like I'm in the dark here.

mdittrich · Post by **mdittrich** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:40 pm

I have an AFE drop in and Mufflex 24 kit. I do not have MDS turned off and my post reflects data on WOT. Have you seen a loss in performance with the adding fuel to remove knock? A guy on the forum running a Mike Wilson tune said once he regulated his to zero his truck runs like a scolded dog.

mdittrich · Post by **mdittrich** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 3:41 pm

oosik, we have talked before on the forum. daprincipal

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 11:29 pm

Oh yeah haha, I broke down and I'm waiting on the Mike Wilson tune.

ssarace · Post by **ssarace** » Tue Dec 22, 2009 1:37 am

Have any of you guys pushed the car into knock, then shut it down and pulled a couple plugs to see if its REALLY knocking? I know on some of the import stuff I do, alot of times we get false knock.. Mabey the sensors are just over active. I'm new to the domestic V8 stuff, but I'll catch up pretty quick.. When our AWD add-on comes for our dyno I'll throw my jeep on there and test this out to see whats really going on.. I suspect that it knocks more with MDS on due to more mechanical noise with the lifters possbily.. I'll post up once I have time to do some testing.. It'll be after the new year when santa delivers our AWD addon

..

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:02 pm

From my understanding others haven't had the same problem with knock when the MDS engages. All I do is monitor it with the Trinity and I notice it occurs as soon as MDS engages. I went and got a custom tune and the amount of knock went down but it's still around 10. I'm almost tempted to sell the Trinity, for $600 bucks I didn't expect so much trouble especially after paying for a custom tune.

Quick · Post by **Quick** » Sun Dec 27, 2009 9:36 pm

ssarace wrote:Have any of you guys pushed the car into knock, then shut it down and pulled a couple plugs to see if its REALLY knocking?

Well...
1) They're talking about Knock RETARD. That's the amount of timing the PCM is pulling in response to a detected knock event. Usually it's a single ping and the PCM has pulled timing before the next combustion cycle. There are limits to what the PCM will pull.Past that you would have actual knock.

2) They're talking about MDS and switching in and out of it. MDS isn't active under WOT (or any significant load) so knock or knock retard isn't so critical (and who cares if you have less power at part throttle? -- just push the pedal down a bit further...)

Note that the Predator tunes do little, if anything at all, to part throttle parameters that might effect knock. The "modify parameters" settings for these parameters only applies to WOT (open loop).

Oosik · Post by **Oosik** » Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:31 pm

Hmm didn't know that. I'd just rather not mess with it anymore. I didn't see the gains I expected and even at part throttle, when logging stock tune I didn't see the knock retard. Only showed up with the canned 87 tune and then the custom tune I got.

'09 RAM 1500 - 87 Tune Knock

'09 RAM 1500 - 87 Tune Knock

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