Turbo Boost pressure leaking into cooling system

[Richd1963]

I have been told by the dealer that when I run my programmer among other things it raises the turbo boost , which in turn leaks exhaust by the heads and enters the cooling system causing the recovery bottle/resovoir to puke coolant all over the inside of the engine compartment. I have actually had to replace up to 2 gallons of fluid while towing with Predator set in the towing program.
When driving without towing, which is what I do most of the time. I usually have the 100hp boost program set in the truck which gives me the best fuel milage. Stock the truck gets around 10+ and with the 65hp program I get around 12+. When the 100hp program is installed I get 14mpg or better. Only problem while excelerating hard the turbo boost climbs as far as 30psi. Which causes the coolant to blow everywhere.
I love the predator and ease of use. I wish I could get on the pedal hard and not have this coolant problem. The truck also goes into defueling once in awhile too, after quick hard acceleration.
If it wasn't for the defueling and overboost I would be one happy camper. I put so much money into the truck. It has a 6" all spring Superlift kit, 35" BFG's. MBRP stainless turbo back with cat delete pipe(maybe I should put that back in to add a little backpressure?), DiProcal Turbo Boost, Trans Temp and Exhaust Gas Temp Gauges, K&N cold air intake kit, fumotomo valve and a kick butt sterio system.
I am frusterated because I like to hot rod it around town but It will undoubtably piss coolant. Is there anyone out there that has any good news for me? Or do I have to drive it more conservatively? I was told sooner or later I will be blowing the heads off or at least the head bolts, and gasket. Yeah! Then I can upgrade to better head bolts. I am through spending $$$ on this beast.
Sorry I am whinning, I am just fed up with the weak ford 6.0 PSD motor. Ford's engineers should be hung for putting out that motor. I wish I had known this stuff before, I would have gotten an older model 7.3 motor, I hear they are beefier and more reliable to modify.
I am totally open for suggestions, constructive criticisim, or even hope.

The truck is an 04 F250 PSD 4x4 CCLB.
Predator sticker on box: 2005 6.0
V.7r81 R10
I don't know what a cal ID is unless it is the vehicles vin? 1FTNW21P.........
Is ther a way to stop the defueling/ total loss of power after a hard exceleration? And I don't think a bigger coolant resovoir will solve the trick, the turbo boost should be staying in the cylinder not leaking through the heads. Help!
Richard

[willie]

I can speak from experience we have a 03 that use to do that and the first step ford will take is to replace the EGR cooler if that does not correct the problem then is up to the dealer to change the head bolts and gaskets, we put ARP studs in our and it has 175k on it now with no more coolant leak, acording to my personal friend that is the main diesel mechanic here in a local dealer well train on 7.3 , 6.0 and 6.4 he tells me that Ford even told them to run the reservour to a minimun to give room for expansion but in rality he telds me head bolts and gaskets is the best solution, we towed our mobil dyno to all the races last year with a 06 KINGRANCH pulling the 13000lb trailer even througth the mountains with the 65hp tune with not one drop, we also have trucks come here to our facility for tune development and see they leak cooland even before we run them, by placing a pressure gauge on the overflow tank i seen pressure reach well over 18 lbs where the factory cap is preset to 16lbs i think your only solution if the EGR cooler is good is to do head studs, not sure if is what you want to hear but it is the facts. thank you[/b]

[Richd1963]

I see that some people have had similar experiences with the Predator. I was wondering if the guys at Diablosport can write a tune that mellows out the turbo boost and maybe holds the tranny in a little longer. Add a defueling fix which may be an RPM thing and It may cause my heads to last longer. I like the 100hp tune, How does it differ from the 60hp tune? Other than the obvious?
Check out this other string at FTE.com
http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/62953 ... ssure.html

Thanks guys. How about hearing from Diablosport?

[Richd1963]

Update.
NOTE: With the coolant bottle/reservoir filled to 1" below the lower level mark.
Also during this testing period I have not ran it hard enough to allow the turbo boost to exceed 25 psi. I say that because it has tipped over the 20 psi mark a few times but not for long periods of time and certainly haven't pegged the needle in the 35 psi. range like in the past.
I have been running the stock program in the truck for a few days and have had no problems with puking. Drove out half a tank of fuel and checked milage. With vehicle @ stock tune I got 13.88 mpg.

I then installed the 30 HP towing tune for a few days and took a MPG reading and noted 12.81 mpg. I also have been driving the vehicle not as aggressive as I usually do, trying to avoid the coolant puking syndrome. As of yet, still no puking.
I am aware that to get an accurate MPG reading I must take the reads more than just one time. I just wanted to have some #s to compare during this time. After I finish my little testing period I will go back and run each tune for a month or so to get a more realistic average MPG.
Yesterday I filled up and upon doing so installed the 60 hp tune. I should have some updates in a few days. One thing for sure is that in order to keep the boost pressure down I have to be very aware of my right foot on the pedal at all times. I used to gun it around alot and now I am not. Also while climbing uphill I have to be careful too. I havn't done any testing while pulling any kind of loads or trailer. I don't do this often enough to run the test.
I sure miss the hard accceleration off the line.
Richard

[cole]

Update.
NOTE: With the coolant bottle/reservoir filled to 1" below the lower level mark.
Also during this testing period I have not ran it hard enough to allow the turbo boost to exceed 25 psi. I say that because it has tipped over the 20 psi mark a few times but not for long periods of time and certainly haven't pegged the needle in the 35 psi. range like in the past.
I have been running the stock program in the truck for a few days and have had no problems with puking. Drove out half a tank of fuel and checked milage. With vehicle @ stock tune I got 13.88 mpg.

I then installed the 30 HP towing tune for a few days and took a MPG reading and noted 12.81 mpg. I also have been driving the vehicle not as aggressive as I usually do, trying to avoid the coolant puking syndrome. As of yet, still no puking.
I am aware that to get an accurate MPG reading I must take the reads more than just one time. I just wanted to have some #s to compare during this time. After I finish my little testing period I will go back and run each tune for a month or so to get a more realistic average MPG.
Yesterday I filled up and upon doing so installed the 60 hp tune. I should have some updates in a few days. One thing for sure is that in order to keep the boost pressure down I have to be very aware of my right foot on the pedal at all times. I used to gun it around alot and now I am not. Also while climbing uphill I have to be careful too. I havn't done any testing while pulling any kind of loads or trailer. I don't do this often enough to run the test.
I sure miss the hard accceleration off the line.
Richard

I have posted in another thread. Fords latest TSB 07-14-5 Which you can obtain off of the same website for the complete TSB info. This TSB applies to all 03-07 6.0L Powerstrokes with coolant issues. this issue occurs to stock non modified trucks. Please read TSB it will explain alot.

[Cyno]

Does anyone have a URL Link to this 07-14-5 Ford TSB?
I've been having the same problem since I installed my predator, and now it happens with the factory tune as well. The other forums, I've read, suggest that the aggressive timing advance the Predator offers, increases the cynlinder pressure to the point where the head bolts are slightly stretched, and just enough cynlinder pressure leaks into the cooling system.

I've always restored the factory tune before it goes back to the dealership.

Just recently I was preparing for a 3K mile vacation trip, when my PS, started pouring TONS of white smoke and coolant out the exhaust, so I immediately shut it down, restored the factory tune, and had it towed to the dealership.

They worked on it for 2.5 days, replaced the turbo, the EGR cooler, and flushed the cooling system, because there was a rusty color in the fluid. I'm now 1100 miles from home, and nervous, because I still have to replace about 1/2gal. of coolant back in for every 250 miles I drive, that is pushing out through the overflow reserviour.

So can anyone comment on this? Is this a vulnerability Ford already has and the power boost of the predator exacerbates the issues? I'm afraid to use my predator now, I'm afraid to keep my PSD, maybe I should dump that too. It is an 04 with 37K miles, it'd be a shame, but so is being stranded.

I'm running the "u7165_pcm_6_0-8r17.crom", but was running a much older version the 65HP Economy firmware version when the problem started, I think it might have been the "power_6_0-7r84_H512.crom".

I know the Banks, boasts more power than the Predator, but is a complete system, so I'm suspicious of the faulty head bolts.

Also, will DiabloSport ever release a tune that is specifically targeted at fuel economy?, I'd love to get more that 16.8 on the highway with no load. I have a friend that gets 23-25 on his 6.0L with the Banks on setting 5-6!!! He does have a manual transmission, but is otherwise the same truck.

[cole]

Does anyone have a URL Link to this 07-14-5 Ford TSB?
I've been having the same problem since I installed my predator, and now it happens with the factory tune as well. The other forums, I've read, suggest that the aggressive timing advance the Predator offers, increases the cynlinder pressure to the point where the head bolts are slightly stretched, and just enough cynlinder pressure leaks into the cooling system.

I've always restored the factory tune before it goes back to the dealership.

Just recently I was preparing for a 3K mile vacation trip, when my PS, started pouring TONS of white smoke and coolant out the exhaust, so I immediately shut it down, restored the factory tune, and had it towed to the dealership.

They worked on it for 2.5 days, replaced the turbo, the EGR cooler, and flushed the cooling system, because there was a rusty color in the fluid. I'm now 1100 miles from home, and nervous, because I still have to replace about 1/2gal. of coolant back in for every 250 miles I drive, that is pushing out through the overflow reserviour.

So can anyone comment on this? Is this a vulnerability Ford already has and the power boost of the predator exacerbates the issues? I'm afraid to use my predator now, I'm afraid to keep my PSD, maybe I should dump that too. It is an 04 with 37K miles, it'd be a shame, but so is being stranded.

I'm running the "u7165_pcm_6_0-8r17.crom", but was running a much older version the 65HP Economy firmware version when the problem started, I think it might have been the "power_6_0-7r84_H512.crom".

I know the Banks, boasts more power than the Predator, but is a complete system, so I'm suspicious of the faulty head bolts.

Also, will DiabloSport ever release a tune that is specifically targeted at fuel economy?, I'd love to get more that 16.8 on the highway with no load. I have a friend that gets 23-25 on his 6.0L with the Banks on setting 5-6!!! He does have a manual transmission, but is otherwise the same truck.

Email has been sent.

[rchouser]

My dealer service department saw puking and low coolant. He told me that the dealer would do the egr cooler, headgaskets, new headbolts (have to do that for the headgaskets anyway). He said the Headbolts were a factory torque issue. He said the headgasket caused the puking and that if you do the headgasket it has proven to be worth doing the EGR Cooler at the same time. All under warranty. On my questioning the need for studs, he told me that the dealership has not had a head back for a second time when his mechanic uses the right torque specs, head gasket, head bolts etc. We shall see. My point is, I believe that low coolant and puking or a Propery Filled cooler bottle will IMMEDIATELY send me back to the dealer to look for headgasket again. thanks rc

[Treestand72]

This is the same problem that I had with my 03 with only 51,000 miles. With the luck of having a friend that used to work at the ford dealer on the 6.0 he said if there is water blowing out that no matter what it would be the head gaskets. The reason for the gaskets blowing is not that the gaskets were the problem but the head bolts would stretch and then of course gaskets would blow. Now remind you that I have had the truck in other ford shops across the Untied States in more than five times for the same problem. It seems to be all the shops would take the eaiest way out and still not would not fix the problem untill our trip back from Utah. So with his highly recomendedation sent the truck to the ford place about 65 miles from my house. The dealer had truck for over a week, but replaced the head gaskets with new studs not the factory bolts. Now remind you that i work in the contruction line of work and do a lot of traveling pulling our fifth wheel camper which we live in while on the road. With the truck fixed this was the first trip that we ever pulled our camper from even when the truck was brand new and you now it no water. Drove to Tyler, Texas just last month 2,000 mile round trip 96 temputure at and average speed of 71 miles per hour. No wate leak of man did not have to smell the anti-freeze cooking on the exhaust lol. Truck now runs better now than from day one good luck.

[Cyno]

Well, I'm back from the 3K trip, running about 70mph most of the way and the only problem has been the loss of coolant, even with the factory program in place, the amount of lost fliud/mile has gone done since I removed the Predator tuning, but still exists, and I have no heat from the heater, even with the system topped off. I'm going to need to take it to the dealer again....bah!

Repeat text:
Will DiabloSport ever release a tune that is specifically targeted at fuel economy?

I'd love to get more that 16.8 on the highway with no load. I have a friend that gets 23-25 on his 6.0L with the Banks on setting 5-6!!! He does have a manual transmission, but is otherwise the same truck. He told me of another guy with a 7.3L that "supposedly" gets 25-28 with his Banks.


Going about 70mph for 2000miles, I got average 17.2mpg, how can these guys get such better mileage? I have a stock '04 6.0L, and they have the Banks with intakes and exhausts. Does anyone have experience that shows that Banks tuner + Exhuast System + Intake = 6-11mpg better economy??

Cole, any comments?

[Cyno]

Does anyone have a URL Link to this 07-14-5 Ford TSB?

This TSB File 7-14-5 Provided by Cole, I just put it on my webserver for everyone else to share.


http://www.luv2frag.com/Powerstroke%5FC ... -14-05.pdf

[Richd1963]

Ya know the dealer tells me the excessive cylinder pressure leaks into the coolant system and causes the overflow and puking. The last time I was at the dealer they charged me a hundred dollar deductable and just gave the computer a new flash and fixed a leaking hose (rubber) to the turbo from the power elbow. Told me to not run the programmer and basically left it at that. I have been puking coolant even without using the tuner and not towing any trailer or carrying any load. I have to throttle it up on the highway hills and once the turbo boost reaches around 25-30psi I am sure the coolant bottle is puking.I add coolant weekly. I refuse to run the truck like some little old lady and I want to drive it like I would drive any vehicle. Like I stole it. I didn't pay for a vehicle I have to nurse. I am going back to the dealer and am getting something done. I plan on keeping my truck for a long time.
How do you get them to redo the heads and use the better headbolts?
Thanks,

[mikel]

Well, for starters, get them to use studs rather than bolts...then you can drive it like you stole it!

Thanks

[Cyno]

Well, here's my follow-up in case it helps anyone else.

After my trip, the truck was still blowing about 1/2 gallon of coolant every 250 miles. So off with the heads!! The dealership replaced them under warranty. When they re-assembled the body back down on the frame, the mechanic slipped and smashed my radiator into the fender. So another two days in their body shop. Then I asked them to do a state vehicle inspection while it was there. They called and told me my ball joints and drag link needed replaced, not under warranty, to the tune of $1,100.

Now my truck has hauled a 5K lbs trailer once, but is otherwise a grocery getter. It has never had a plow installed, but does have the snow plow package. (Extra springs, dual alternator, dual batteries). At that point I got seriously mad. The truck was in the shop collectively over 1/2 the month, they had supposedly billed $7K-$8K in warranty work, banged it up and fixed it, and now wanted another $1,100!!!

It's hard to understand how the #1 truck in America, an F250 PSD with under 40K miles, hardly labored, other than my Predator , needed almost $10K in work to keep it on the road. #1 truck my A#$!! You buy a $45K truck and have to have $10K in repairs in 3 years?? I returned home without the inspection sticker, and kept my $1,100. about 10 days later I returned and had them inspect it again, while straightening the steering column for the third time, because they put it on crooked 2x. And what do you know, suddenly the front end was perfect and passed the state inspection?!. Talk about dealership BS! BTW the name of the dealership is Vision Ford in Greece, NY. They run quite an operation.... They also pulled some shady crap when I bought the truck, told me take it home the financing was all set, we'd sign the papers in a day or two. I'm an idiot. They sent my F150 Lariat Crew trade to auction, then called and said they had to go through a different bank and the rate was higher. But now I had no vehicle if I didn't sign. Like I said, I'm an idiot, should have just called a lawyer right then, instead I had PSD lust and signed.

So in all of this, I don't know if I'm going to keep the truck, I bought it with the intention of driving it for 15 years and 300K miles, if I have to dump $10K in every 40K miles, I don't think I can afford the #1 truck in America. And that's not even using to it do real work.

But for those of you here because your truck is puking coolant, yep it's probably the head bolts and factory bolt torque pattern flaw, take it in right away before you really have problems.

Much as I love the way it drives, the power, the overall feel of the truck, I gotta say those Toyota trucks are gaining my interest, I'll bet you can drive those practically forever, like their cars.

Peace

[Cyno]

Repeat text:
Will DiabloSport ever release a tune that is specifically targeted at fuel economy?

I'd love to get more that 16.8 on the highway with no load. I have a friend that gets 23-25 on his 6.0L with the Banks on setting 5-6!!! He does have a manual transmission, but is otherwise the same truck. He told me of another guy with a 7.3L that "supposedly" gets 25-28 with his Banks.


Going about 70mph for 2000miles, I got average 17.2mpg, how can these guys get such better mileage? I have a stock '04 6.0L, and they have the Banks with intakes and exhausts. Does anyone have experience that shows that Banks tuner + Exhuast System + Intake = 6-11mpg better economy??

Cole, any comments? Confused