2004 Mach 1 - new u7146_mustang-9r05 crom not helping

[twogts4us]

I just installed the new update for my U7146 and it's worse than the old tune I had...much worse. It used to ping slightly on the ragged edge at 6200+, but now it seems I can get it to do it much more frequently. In addition, it bogged badly as if it hit the rev limiter in a 1-2 and 2-3 shift when I hammered it on the highway from a 10 MPH roll. Maybe I did hit the limiter..? Nonetheless, around town driveability seemed to be somewhat improved and I was initially happy with the tune, but I now cannot squeeze it without fear of pretty severe detonation.
I used the canned tune previously and used the canned tune with this new update (u7146_mustang-9r05). The only change I make for each scenario is to turn off the TC.
Engine mods are, for the moment, limited to UDPs, MRT Cold Air kit, Magnaflow catted X and Magnaflow Magnapack catback.
I have an Innovate Motorsports Wideband LC-1 and their G2 gauge but I have yet to install it...awaiting more cash flow to get the Speed Of Sound gauge pod (With two kids, Christmas is never a good time to buy stuff for myself!)
Any help? Advice? A better tune for this combo?
Thanks very much!

[Shaken]

Are you using 93 octane fuel? if so you need to data log you timing at W.O.T. I have a custom tune based on 9r05 I see anywhere from 24 degrees to 21.5 degrees W.O.T 4k - 7K in 4th gear and 26 to 23.5 degrees from 2k - 4k in 4th gear.

[twogts4us]

yep, using 93 octane. I'll try datalogging tomorrow. But again, it's based on the canned Diablo tune for the Mach 1 in the new 9ro5 release. Won't they be fixed values?

[Shaken]

yep, using 93 octane. I'll try datalogging tomorrow. But again, it's based on the canned Diablo tune for the Mach 1 in the new 9ro5 release. Won't they be fixed values?

No, timing requirements are determined by information from multiple sensors.

Try this site it may help you understand the strategies. http://fordfuelinjection.com/?p=64

[twogts4us]

Informative link - thanks. I didnt get a chance to datalog today, but I will tomorrow. It's bad though...I never had an issue with pinging like I do now. If I get into 4th gear quickly, at low speeds, then floor it (from 35MPH+-), it pings badly...and it would NEVER do that before. I'll likely gather the data, then remove the tune completely as it's just flat out dangerous.

[Shaken]

You should try to data log both the stock tune and the performance tune and post up results. Maybe one of the techs will chime in once you post up some data. You could also try to adjust your factory tune after you install your wideband o2. Adding fuel to the performance tune could be your issue but you dont have your wideband installed to actually see what your Mach needs. If you feel uncomfortable in adjusting your fuel or timing i would suggest taking it to a CMR dealer and getting a custom tune. Also you could retard your timing in the 2k -4k. Start a -10% retard and work your way up till it knocks and the same if you hear detonation above 4k.

[twogts4us]

Wanted to provide an update, though I haven't datalogged yet (my mother is in the hospital, so we've been running up and down the highway to see her...). Anyway, last night I decided to check under the hood and low and behold I found the rubber adapter from the inlet tube to the throttle body was loose and allowing un-metered air in. After taking it all off the car, I found the rubber adapter has a couple of small rips in it from overtightning, so it's effectively garbage at this point.
I swapped it out for the OEM stuff. but kept the MAF adapter and K&N filter. A quick drive last night proved that this was better, but it would still ping badly when trying to pull at low speeds (30-35 MPH) in 4th gear (1500-2000 RPMS).
So this morning I went with the completely stock air intake, including the MAF screen, paper filter and even the 'horn' that goes into the fender to grab cool air. Absolutely bone stock now. (I do, however, have a Magnaflow catted X and Magnapack catback)
Result - still pings, but doesn't seem to do it at 2000 RPMs but it will at 1500 RPMs.
THE WORST PART -->at 4700 RPMs it absolutely falls on it's face, bogs badly. This is where I had thought I'd possibly hit the rev limiter, but in hindsight, I now see where it is happening (nowhere near the redline). It is consistent in doing this. It's making good power, beginning to spin the 315/35's at about 4200 RPMs+ in 2nd gear, but then it hits this wall at about 4700 RPMs.
I owe you some datalogging, I know...but I just wanted to get these updates out here before I forget. I also need to install my wideband, even without the gauge, at least for now. I'll post up some additional info and data as soon as I can.
SHAKEN, THANKS VERY MUCH for your input and guidance.

[Shaken]

Since you have found some issues and corrected them you still might have more. I would reinstall your factory tune and run the car and see if you still have any remaining issues. Also when was the last time you changed your fuel filter. Data logging W.O.T. look at your fuel pressure.

[twogts4us]

When you say reinstall the factory tune, do you mean uninstall the Diablo tune completely - aka return to stock?
Fuel filter changed less than 5K miles ago. I'm a stickler for this maintenance chore, as it's really easy and cheap. The car has only 25K miles on it, but I like to change the fuel filter twice a year - overkill? Maybe, but if you blow thru a new filter then blow thru an old one, even one with only 5K miles on it, you'll really notice the resistance caused by built up gunk in the old one.
I've got an Autometer Fuel Pressure gauge to install as well...these are leftover parts from my 2002 GT which I setup to run nitrous. I pulled these things off before the flatbed came and carted it off. I hope to install the wideband and the FP gauge one of these days...I, at least, would like to get the wideband installed, even if I do it without the gauge for now, so I can datalog from there as well.
I'll do some datalogging tomorrow and get back to you - thanks again for your help!
Chris

[twogts4us]

OK, I reverted back to the stock tune/reset the Predator and it runs well, although I didn't have the chance to jump on it and see if the 4700 RPM bogging curse still exists. I did conclude that the low speed/high gear chugging no longer causes any pinging whatsoever, so I'm happy to report that bit of success, albeit with the OEM tune now.
I also just reflashed my own brain, reminding myself how to datalog and did a sample test. Now I'm fighting with getting the file off the handheld and onto my PC to share with you. I think it's time to reboot...

[twogts4us]

I just made a couple on the road runs from idle to about 6K RPMs. The 4700 RPM curse is gone without the Diablo tune. Attached is just a sample log file I made while simple idling in the garage. First, I wanted to ensure that I was able to attach it to this thread and secondly, I wondered what parameters I should be sampling...?
In this sample, I pulled RPMs, FRP (Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor), Spark, ECT (Engine Coolant Temp), and SHRTFT1 and 2 (Short Term Fuel Trim-Banks 1 and 2).
Thanks!
Chris

[Shaken]

http://fordfuelinjection.com/?p=9
I am pretty sure if you want to keep running your 160 degree thermostat you will need a custom tune. Unless it is just stuck open in that case you need to replace it. Download cmr dat in the download section and you can look at your logging on your pc. http://diablosport.com/CMR/software/Gen ... .1.8.5.exe

http://fordfuelinjection.com/?p=64
please read this it will help you understand why you are getting detonation at low speeds the computer is trying to get the engine to 185 degrees. The strategies it uses to do this are listed. Since you cant change those strategies with a Predator you would have to rely on a custom tune. If you are running a 160 thermostat your Mach in this log never went over 162 degrees.

[twogts4us]

A couple items: First, I wasn't aware that it had a 160 thermostat. I bought it used, in absolutely mint condition with 19K miles on it last April. It had a few bolt on goodies already, the couple of engine mods and suspension stuff (MM, UPR, Steeda, etc). It's no surprise that he put a 160 in there, it's just news to me. Now based on the fact that I'm in FLORIDA, does that factor into the equation? Meaning, is it OK to run a 160? Most folks say to go 180, but no less.

And B: My notes on a 180 thermostat tell me to set the low fan on at 180, off at 178 and high fan on at 190 and off at 188. Can I apply this to the 160 degree thermostat by simply subtracting 20 degrees?

#3 - Furthermore, it should be noted that I did this sample test run in the garage with, I believe, a fairly cold engine, so it may not have had the chance to get up to the proper operating temp. I'll datalog later today with the engine warm to know for sure.
I'm pretty certain, however, that the low speed pinging was happening with a warm engine.

C: - I just installed the 3.1.8.5 DataViewer - oh man, so much better than the 2.0 version I was using.

Thanks again for your help. I'll get some meaningful datalogging done, hopefully today, and get it posted up here.

Chris

[sohfast94]

Yes I would like to see what this thing is doing... can you post a link of this intake you are using?

[Shaken]

Yes I would like to see what this thing is doing... can you post a link of this intake you are using?

Wanted to provide an update, though I haven't datalogged yet (my mother is in the hospital, so we've been running up and down the highway to see her...). Anyway, last night I decided to check under the hood and low and behold I found the rubber adapter from the inlet tube to the throttle body was loose and allowing un-metered air in. After taking it all off the car, I found the rubber adapter has a couple of small rips in it from overtightning, so it's effectively garbage at this point.
I swapped it out for the OEM stuff. but kept the MAF adapter and K&N filter. A quick drive last night proved that this was better, but it would still ping badly when trying to pull at low speeds (30-35 MPH) in 4th gear (1500-2000 RPMS).
So this morning I went with the completely stock air intake, including the MAF screen, paper filter and even the 'horn' that goes into the fender to grab cool air. Absolutely bone stock now. (I do, however, have a Magnaflow catted X and Magnapack catback)
Result - still pings, but doesn't seem to do it at 2000 RPMs but it will at 1500 RPMs.
THE WORST PART -->at 4700 RPMs it absolutely falls on it's face, bogs badly. This is where I had thought I'd possibly hit the rev limiter, but in hindsight, I now see where it is happening (nowhere near the redline). It is consistent in doing this. It's making good power, beginning to spin the 315/35's at about 4200 RPMs+ in 2nd gear, but then it hits this wall at about 4700 RPMs.
I owe you some datalogging, I know...but I just wanted to get these updates out here before I forget. I also need to install my wideband, even without the gauge, at least for now. I'll post up some additional info and data as soon as I can.
SHAKEN, THANKS VERY MUCH for your input and guidance.

sohfast94 thanks for chiming in. Chris nice find on your new Mach sorry I did not mean to imply you purposely installed the stat. Even in Fla I would not use a 160 stat. There has been much debate on what temp stat comes with a Mach factory 180 or 190 on the mach1registry.com, if you are not a member sign up lots of us Machers there. Your log seemed like about 10 minutes or so and near the end you where varying your RPMS from the start of the log to the finish it only went up 154 to 162 I assumed the vehicle was warm from looking at you idle speeds which btw factory is 750 yours dipped into the 720 range. Is this a stick or a auto ? What about you traction control that would cause a issue with a bog if your spinning the tires. I turned mine off in my tune damn didnt think to ask you that sorry.