Auto shutoff - "Possibly" Killing Battery

[TIGwelder]

Vehicle: 08 Dodge Super Bee

Garage stored in SW Florida and never had any problems until I installed Trinity unit in the car last week.

I don't drive my car daily. Usually once or twice a week and it's only been 4 or 5 days since I last drove it.

The Trinity has run my battery down below 4 volts. Deader than dead. I had to jump start the battery charger with a 9 volt battery to even get it to kick on and start charging. The car is backed in the garage and I can't even get it in neutral to get it outside to jump.

The unit is definitely not powering off. I see others are having the same problem. No...I didn't leave anything on and there are no other aftermarket accessories in the car. Doors and trunk closed.

Can a software addition be made to just shut it off completely after 5 minutes of key off? No need for a fast start up.

The connector on the bottom of the Trinity is a little tough and I see problems if I'm constantly having to disconnect and reconnect the cable. Not to mention bending the mount to get to the cable etc, etc

Den

[mikel]

Current draw when the unit goes to sleep should be nill...there was another Dodge guy having a similar issue, which has been tracked down to a car issue, let me find the post...

[Quick]

You mean this one? He's still diagnosing it.

http://www.diablosport.com/index.php?na ... torder=asc

[mikel]

yeah, thats it....as you can see its not just the trinity, he has the same issue with his dashawk too, so it looks like a problem with the car.

[TIGwelder]

The only thing not stock on my car is the thermostat. No amps, no extra lighting, etc . I had no problems until the unit was first installed in the vehicle the last time I drove it. That would be last weekend. I would bet if it's disconnected while storing then my battery would be fine. The car has sat for weeks and always held up with no signs of battery problems. Hit the key and it instantly starts.

I'll charge up the battery and log some battery voltage testing over several days with and without the tuner.
The blinking LED of death will not win

Not trying to bad mouth your product...but maybe it's the length of time between running or it's keeping the electronics in the car active or something.

I've changing the post heading to say "possibly"
At least look into it.

Den

[Quick]

Mike, It would help people troubleshoot this if you could give us an idea of the Trinity logic for going to sleep.

If it's something like periodically checking for activity on the bus and someone maybe has OnStar or the likes then that might be keeping it awake for a very few people while it works fine for others. Another example with the Chargers (maybe all the LXs), there was that "heartbeat" problem where the subwoofer would periodically "thump" softly after the car was shut off. The fix was flashing the sunroof control module (in the overhead console). That had to be bus traffic. etc.

[TIGwelder]

My sub thumps but I don't have a sunroof.
Seems to be anytime an interior light comes on .. Shortly after "thump thump"

Den

[Quick]

My sub thumps but I don't have a sunroof.
Seems to be anytime an interior light comes on .. Shortly after "thump thump"

Den

That was just an example. It was a year or two ago and the sub would thump periodically all night long. It was pretty subtle too.

[TIGwelder]

I've done some testing. I charged the battery up and tested the standing voltage every few hours without the Trinity hooked up
It took a a little while for the battery to settle down from the charging.

Car sitting in garage unlocked with factory alarm system off. Trunk open with latch locked to shut off trunk light.

09:15pm - 13.30

12:00am - 12.98
03:00am - 12.95
12:00pm - 12.90
03:00pm - 12.89
06:00pm - 12.88
09:15pm - 12.87

12:15am - 12.86
03:45am - 12.85
12:00pm - 12.82
02:30pm - 12.82
09:30pm - 12.80

12:00am - 12.79
03:00am - 12.79
01:00pm - 12.76

So it was staying charged. 12.80 is considered a full charged battery, 12.30 is considered 50% and less 11.8 is considered 0% as per charger manual. Remember my battery was under 4v in original post after 5 days.

I then hooked up the Trinity and keyed the ignition to on (not start) and put the tuner into monitoring mode. I then turned the key off. It gave the normal message saying it lost the data stream.
I DID NOT hit "Halt monitoring". The unit went into sleep mode.

This is when I noticed that every 21-28 seconds the sub would softly thump. I was timing it with the stopwatch function of my iPhone. One test it was 21 seconds apart exactly ...another test it was 28 seconds apart.

I tried this a few times with the same results. I had the door closed and the tuner sitting on the cowl area. Once I disconnect the Trinity the sub would stop thumping.

I then tried with the Trinity sitting at the main menu and entering sleep mode. No thump.
Back to leaving in monitoring mode and not hitting "halt monitoring" and it thumps.

So what I'm seeing from my tests is that if you let the unit go to sleep without hitting the "halt monitoring" it continues to generate traffic even though it has entered sleep mode. I figured once it went to sleep it would stop trying to monitor. That doesn't seem to be the case.

If this is true, can we get an option so sleep mode means "stop monitoring and power off" and we can just hit a button to turn it back on when needed?

Or change the button option from "halt monitoring" to "continue monitoring". Opting in instead of out as a default so hitting the button isn't needed every shutdown?

So my questions are...
If you shut off the vehicle in monitoring mode does it continue to monitor even though the unit has entered it's sleep mode?
Is sleep mode a power down or does the screen just shutdown?

Den

[TIGwelder]

My sub thumps but I don't have a sunroof.
Seems to be anytime an interior light comes on .. Shortly after "thump thump"

Den

That was just an example. It was a year or two ago and the sub would thump periodically all night long. It was pretty subtle too.

When I original said my sub thumped..I meant when you shut off the vehicle it would thump a few times (like 4) and stop. Now after my tests I'm seeing the periodically continuous thump.

[Quick]

Did you do the voltage monitoring with the T in monitor mode? Actually, checking current draw would be more interesting for this.

The check every 20 seconds or so would/could be expected. About the only way you can implement auto-on is to wake up periodically and check for activity on the bus. I'm not sure how that's done but it's most likely to send a command. It could either be sending a command for bus status or simply polling for some parameter.

So the T is probably going to wake up periodically and check. If it doesn't detect bus activity then it's going to immediately go back to sleep. Shouldn't be a problem? The problem is going to be if it wakes up completely, draws a measurable amount of current for some time instead of going back to sleep right away. In normal sleep mode I would expect to see some very small current draw with momentary spikes (almost instantaneous) when it checks for activity. You can add up the current draw over time. The problem is going to come if it wakes up and stays awake for a while before going back to sleep. Again you could add up the current draw over some period of time like a few minutes to see if it's going to be a factor over a night time.

[TIGwelder]

Drain wise I think it's the difference between "sleep mode" and "sleep mode and still monitoring"

Logging voltages with it sleeping at main menu and it's looking decent so far.

I think if you don't hit "halt monitoring" it justs turns off the screen and continues to monitor everything. I just don't understand why that would be the default requiring a button press every shutdown.

I will test it in the monitoring/sleep mode where it makes the amp/sub thump for voltage drop.

Den

Den

[SRTorRed6sp]

I'm the guy in other thread. I have the EXACT same problem. I forgot to mention the speaker noise. I'm not sure it's just from the sub on mine though. Mine sounds more like it's all the speakers and more of a soft boosh type noise. The only other time I hear that noise is while charging the battery. If my battery charger kicks off and then kicks back on it makes the same noise as it does if the T is hooked up and the monitoring is not halted at key off.

[TIGwelder]

Ok. I did the voltage tests with the T in sleep mode at the "halt monitoring" screen. Sound system making noises.

Sleep + monitoring

05:00pm - 12.73
07:00pm - 12.47
10:30pm - 12.32
12:00am - 12.26
02:30am - 12.12
04:00am - 12.06
05:00am - 12.02
11:30am - 11.77

I stopped and put the battery back on charge. You can see how fast it's draining.

My suggestions:

Current key off screen
=================
Data stream lost.
Waiting for start
[ halt monitoring? ]
=================

change to:

=================
Data stream lost.
Continue Monitoring?
[ YES ] [ NO* ]
=================

Defaults to NO if no selection is made

Code: Select all

-detect key off
-wait 5 seconds checking for ignition on
-set default choice to 'No'
-display prompt screen
-wait 10 seconds for input (current time too short )
-if 'yes' then {
          'continue monitoring' 
} else  {
          - 'stop monitoring'
          -sleep mode
          -display off
}

Den

[Quick]

Can you log current draw? or are you just sampling the voltage periodically.
It would be interesting to see if the current draw is continuous or spikes?
If it spikes, then for how long and interval inbetween?
Is the "spike" current draw the same as the full on draw?